Dr. Jane Clare Jones Prof. Grace Lavery @ThaneSagarQs Katy Montgomerie 🦗 Dr Debbie Hayton Emma Hilton Kathleen Stock I do not know you or this forum, but as an archaeologist I'm troubled to see this diagram coupled with your seemingly unrelated thread. What intellectual labor are you trying to do by using this diagram of the progression of an ancient Mesopotamian written language?

Dr. Jane Clare Jones Prof. Grace Lavery @ThaneSagarQs Katy Montgomerie 🦗 Dr Debbie Hayton Emma Hilton Kathleen Stock It seems that the goal here was to claim that one particularly famous Mesopotamian language having a symbol that is believed to note 'female' indicates anything about gender categories now, which is an absolutely WILD jump in logic, and one I'd not expect from a philosopher.

Kate Ellenberger Dr. Jane Clare Jones Prof. Grace Lavery @ThaneSagarQs Katy Montgomerie 🦗 Dr Debbie Hayton Emma Hilton Kathleen Stock So, it's an outlier then? There is no evidence that people recognised the natural categories of male and female in other languages, we have no documentary evidence of this from the whole range of human literature, and there is certainly nothing from the natural sciences....

Kate Ellenberger Dr. Jane Clare Jones Prof. Grace Lavery @ThaneSagarQs Katy Montgomerie 🦗 Dr Debbie Hayton Emma Hilton Kathleen Stock that might suggest that humans (and other species) can recognise biological sex in their own species? It's just this, and logic?

Gary Molloy Kate Ellenberger Dr. Jane Clare Jones Prof. Grace Lavery @ThaneSagarQs Katy Montgomerie 🦗 Dr Debbie Hayton Emma Hilton Kathleen Stock They had a symbol for God as well, Gary. Do you think that makes God a scientific reality too?

Wooloo | @mockwooloo.bsky.social Kate Ellenberger Dr. Jane Clare Jones Prof. Grace Lavery @ThaneSagarQs Katy Montgomerie 🦗 Dr Debbie Hayton Emma Hilton Kathleen Stock The point is that we can be sure sexual dimorphism is a reality and God probably isn't through scientific means other than reading cunieform tablets. It would be a surprise however if you could produce evidence of a society that rejected the existence of women? Got any?

Gary Molloy Wooloo | @mockwooloo.bsky.social Dr. Jane Clare Jones Prof. Grace Lavery @ThaneSagarQs Katy Montgomerie 🦗 Dr Debbie Hayton Emma Hilton Kathleen Stock My understanding is that from a biological point of view, sexual dimorphism among humans is much less significant than it is in most other species. This is probably an oversimplification but nonetheless I do not think your foundation is sound. Nothing is this simple.

Gary Molloy Wooloo | @mockwooloo.bsky.social Dr. Jane Clare Jones Prof. Grace Lavery @ThaneSagarQs Katy Montgomerie 🦗 Dr Debbie Hayton Emma Hilton Kathleen Stock Nobody claimed that a category 'women' does not exist. People who are 'gender critical' are defending what they see as the boundaries that distinguish that category against what they perceive as a threat.

Kate Ellenberger Gary Molloy Wooloo | @mockwooloo.bsky.social Dr. Jane Clare Jones Prof. Grace Lavery @ThaneSagarQs Katy Montgomerie 🦗 Emma Hilton Kathleen Stock Sexual dimorphism is simple. Two sex classes. I bet you have two biological parents; one from each class.

The question is whether women are oppressed on the basis of their sex, or how they present themselves in society. The answer to that determines how we define the boundaries.

Dr Debbie Hayton Gary Molloy Wooloo | @mockwooloo.bsky.social Dr. Jane Clare Jones Prof. Grace Lavery @ThaneSagarQs Katy Montgomerie 🦗 Emma Hilton Kathleen Stock I do have two biological parents, but I have very little knowledge about their hormones, genitals, and other sex characteristics. I do, however, know their genders.

I do not think we will become closer on this issue as we see the roots of oppression very differently.

Kate Ellenberger Dr Debbie Hayton Gary Molloy Wooloo | @mockwooloo.bsky.social Dr. Jane Clare Jones Prof. Grace Lavery @ThaneSagarQs Katy Montgomerie 🦗 Emma Hilton Kathleen Stock You can’t even hazard a guess at who birthed you?? 🤣🤣🤣